So We Have Multiple Statements By Jorge Rivera-Herrans That He Was Inspired By Video Games In The Creation

So we have multiple statements by Jorge Rivera-Herrans that he was inspired by video games in the creation of Epic the Musical. This is pretty plainly seen in the multiple “boss battles” that cap off most albums in the musical.

Two of the most important examples of “boss battles” come from the characters recognized as “monsters” in the canon of the story: Polyphemus and Scylla. These two are important, because they are the only two characters with songs named after them. This sets them apart as unique and special, which is substantiated even further by the impact they have on the wider story of Epic.

“…but wait” you may be asking. “Odysseus has a song named after him as well, no?” That is correct! This is because, like Polyphemus and Scylla, Odysseus is a monster. So much so that there’s an entire song in the Underworld Sage.

Okay so- what does this mean effectively? Well… the final boss of the musical isn’t the suitors. It’s Ody. The song Odysseus has a lot of parallels to Polyphemus and Scylla (the line “keep your head down he’s aiming for the torches!” Being a direct callback to Scylla), but the one I’d like to focus on is the narrative framework of the song.

He’s the antagonist. The song’s narrative is carried by the disparate Suitors as they are hunted by our old king and try to survive. (heh. See what I did there?) The background chanting of Odysseus’s name is even in the same style of how Polyphemus is sung in Survive!!! He’s the FINAL BOSS. (and tbh. He’s a LOT better at murdering everyone who wronged him than anyone else in the story. Polyphemus should take notes.)

So… what does this mean? He kills every suitor. And like- as he should. They sucked. So what? The final boss isn’t defeated in Epic?

…well no. He is firmly defeated in the end. By Penelope. Something very important in the story from No Longer You onward is this division between the “Old Odysseus” and the “New Odysseus”. It’s this Old Odysseus who is a monster, and it’s THIS man who Penelope defeats.

Her defeat of Odysseus is shown in two parts: Lyrically and Musically. The first is very clear. Odysseus argues that he is no longer the man who married Penelope, and she disagrees. She is the only one to effectively trick Penelope, responding to his rhetorical statement of “I am no longer the man you fell in love with” with a trap that ends with Odysseus confirming beyond a shadow of a doubt that he is, in fact, her husband. Furthermore If you payed any attention at all while listening to Epic, Jorge’s love for motif is very clear, and this is relevant in understanding the emotional “defeat” of the Monster Odysseus.

Ody has two key instruments: a soft guitar and a harsh, electric one. These correlate to the two unique Odysseus’s we’ve established. We hear inklings of the soft guitar when Odysseus and Penelope first reunite, but it quickly fades to that harsh electric guitar as they begin to “fight.”

But. Here’s. Where. It. Gets. Fun. Because after he’s deceived and defeated, the soft guitar returns. He is finally, after twenty years, being allowed to return to the kind man he once was. He’s finally, *finally* home.

And that, my friends, is why I conclude, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Penelope tops Odysseus after Epic.

More Posts from Shoccoe and Others

7 months ago

Alright, so for a brief rundown of some of what I *think* the themes of Cradle and The Last Horizon are:

Cradle -- with enough power, you can do almost anything, but not everything. Also, the society mirrors an exaggerated version of capitalism where economic and political power are interchangeable at the highest levels, that power is half-created by being a "big player" who has more leverage to create wealth, and half-taken from those below you; also also, it's a somewhat-meritocracy where talent is rewarded, but only if you're exceptionally lucky -- by running into resources yourself, or getting a sponsor who is willing to commit Big Nepotism. Finally, there will always be problems with big enough systems -- but you can still change them to be better -- and change can cost unimaginable resources and lives. There are more themes than this, but these are the ones I'd remark on.

The Last Horizon -- there are always fires to put out, and you can't go wrong trying to put them out. And people will always get in your way of putting out those fires because they personally benefit from them, and also because they value their autonomy or something.

The Last Horizon is much shorter than Cradle, on account of being ongoing and also just being a more streamlined story, and its setting being less possible to twist into a real-world allegory. But it is also true that I haven't examined either story deeply, and could stand to do some more in-depth analysis.

Anyway. Enjoy the crumbs, fellow Cradle and TLH mutuals.

1 month ago

It aches my heart to see people get injured… it’s almost more painful to me than seeing people die in books. She’s paralyzed. It’s… I- it’s so heartbreaking to witness. I feel so much desire to help Rysn, but she’s not even real. Aaghck. Empathy suuucccckkkssss sometimes.


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1 week ago

hot damn, I was right about that last part lmfao

I have a gut instinct telling me this butler character is gonna be a highlight. His sass. His attitude. His barely constrained urge to strangle Wax… It’s beautiful.


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2 weeks ago

They call him Adolin “I’ll fight as many at once as I have to” Kholin. Genuinely what the fuck. What the fuck do they put in this man’s food. He never even considered the fact he could lose. It- oh my God.


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3 weeks ago

I’M A FUCKING GENIUS.

Stormlight Spoilers

Hmmm…. Okay so I have a weird theory stuck in my head. It’s- bad and doesn’t make sense, especially because Renarin has already demonstrated a traditional Surge, but: While reading, I keep getting the vibe that Renarin’s spren bond is wrong. I don’t fully understand why, but I keep thinking he’s perhaps bonded to a renegade void spren.

The numbers in Words of Radiance were ABSOLUTELY done by Renarin. I don’t doubt it for a second. I’m so confident about this. But… well we know the two surges of the Truthwatchers, and future prediction was NOT one of them. Beyond that, when Shallan is fighting the Unmade in Urithiru, it mentions trying to take Pattern’s place, which all but STATES non-Radiant spren can form bonds with humans… ergo, it’s feasible for Renarin to have bonded one of the Void Spren, which would facilitate the future stuff!

Anywho, that’s that! I think it’s likely I’m wrong, but could be interesting!

1 week ago

The. The big reveal????

Stormlight Archives Spoilers

Hmmm… the Fourth Ideal, something Kaladin cannot say… if we look at the themes of his story so far, it’s probably something like “I will protect only those I can”. Kaladin has always struggled with accepting that he can’t save EVERYONE, because he is just… too compassionate, but it’s gotten to the point where it’s crippling his ability to act, to save anyone. I expect Rhythm of War is gonna have a lot of Kaladin brooding

1 week ago

Wind and Truth Spoilers (Maybe)

Yeah so I’m like… 90% sure Taravangian!Odium is going to elect like- some total innocent as his champion. I don’t remember he or Dalinar imposing any like… restrictions on who could be chosen as a champion. So like… while there’s a chance it’s a powerful Fused, I think a more surefire bet would be something akin to a Singer child. A sickly, frail Singer child. A blind sickly Singer child with no parents. Taravangian listened to Dalinar rant about “journey matching the destination” so many times. It’s uh! Yeah. I’m worried for our man.


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1 week ago

your heart is a muscle the size of a rat

2 weeks ago

His depression absolutely CRUSHES this poor man whenever he isn’t doing his best Gravity Rush impression

Kaladin feels actively nerfed when not using his Radiant powers it’s genuinely insane.

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